Mik1984
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Does the combat ability bonus apply only to your regular troops or also to mercs under your command?
Ironside121
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All bonuses apply to all troops under your command.
However I do believe instead of making mercs more expensive to nerf the merc spam, they should've just given them flat abilities by not giving them the nations modifiers as it's possible to give certain unit types certain abilities, as proven in the next patch (banners getting 10% discipline).
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Martynios
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Ironside121 said:
All bonuses apply to all troops under your command.
However I do believe instead of making mercs more expensive to nerf the merc spam, they should've just given them flat abilities by not giving them the nations modifiers as it's possible to give certain unit types certain abilities, as proven in the next patch (banners getting 10% discipline).
So much this. And a flat cap.
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Incompetent
Euroweenie in Exile
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Ironside121 said:
All bonuses apply to all troops under your command.
However I do believe instead of making mercs more expensive to nerf the merc spam, they should've just given them flat abilities by not giving them the nations modifiers as it's possible to give certain unit types certain abilities, as proven in the next patch (banners getting 10% discipline).
Yep. It's always irked me that mercenary regiments (who are presumably foreigners for the most part) fight better just because they are carrying a Prussian flag instead of a Hamburger one.
If you did make this change though, it would be a pretty major shift for MP, given how heavily players typically stack the idea/policy bonuses. If mercs miss out on all that and just get a flat 10% discipline or something, they're going to get shredded on contact with any regular player army, so wars would be won by whoever runs out of manpower last, even if the belligerents are very rich. Quantity ideas would probably have to be nerfed to stop them being the biggest no-brainer ever. In SP, trying to beat the AI on military quality would be much more of an investment, because you'd also have to build up enough manpower to stop using mercs in your main battle stacks; I suspect a lot of players would find it more efficient to forget about military ideas and stick to just outblobbing the AI.
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TenshiN
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Incompetent said:
Yep. It's always irked me that mercenary regiments (who are presumably foreigners for the most part) fight better just because they are carrying a Prussian flag instead of a Hamburger one.
If you did make this change though, it would be a pretty major shift for MP, given how heavily players typically stack the idea/policy bonuses. If mercs miss out on all that and just get a flat 10% discipline or something, they're going to get shredded on contact with any regular player army, so wars would be won by whoever runs out of manpower last, even if the belligerents are very rich. Quantity ideas would probably have to be nerfed to stop them being the biggest no-brainer ever. In SP, trying to beat the AI on military quality would be much more of an investment, because you'd also have to build up enough manpower to stop using mercs in your main battle stacks; I suspect a lot of players would find it more efficient to forget about military ideas and stick to just outblobbing the AI.
Eh? Isn't it already what everyone does in SP? Mercs are too expensive unless you blob hard 
I'd say that to nerf merc spam they should increase the consequences of taking loans and especially going bankrupt, because as i've read numerous times, there are lots of strategies based on extensive loaning and even bankrupting oneself.
Increasing inflation from loans along with also getting a prestige and diprep hit? I think that would be more of a solution that what currently is in place.
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H
Hessian Mercenary
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I agree that mercs shouldn't get national modifiers but instead just start with some boni of their own. Maybe later there could be a global event (tied to the end of the Religious League War, certain tech or something) increasing merc maintenance but also manpower pool and recovery rate to represent the shift to national armies and more efficient conscripting methods
Anthedon
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Or make mercenary companies available for hire that have a specific composition/leader/trait/bonus. A bit like in CKII.
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saegoto
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IMHO an easy and reasonable way to nerf merc spam is to reduce merc pool from land forcelimit from 30% to 5% and make that Discipline does not count to them, which is logical from historical perspective
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Dominion
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saegoto said:
IMHO an easy and reasonable way to nerf merc spam is to reduce merc pool from land forcelimit from 30% to 5% and make that Discipline does not count to them, which is logical from historical perspective
Could just strip them of army tradition instead. Merc pools always felt weird to me. I should be able to hire as many as I want imo.
And one shouldn't underestimate how much a lack of NIs alone would hurt. That's a lot of morale and discipline down the drain for most nations.
Would also be a very heavy nerf to Prussia.
Taking army tradition and/or NIs would make a lot of sense since they are neither from your nation nor did they endure your military's training.
TenshiN said:
Eh? Isn't it already what everyone does in SP? Mercs are too expensive unless you blob hard
No.
TenshiN said:
I'd say that to nerf merc spam they should increase the consequences of taking loans and especially going bankrupt, because as i've read numerous times, there are lots of strategies based on extensive loaning and even bankrupting oneself.
NO!
H
Hessian Mercenary
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Anthedon said:
Or make mercenary companies available for hire that have a specific composition/leader/trait/bonus. A bit like in CKII.
too similar to Condottieri, which are sadly hidden behind the Mare Nostrum DLC
saegoto said:
IMHO an easy and reasonable way to nerf merc spam is to reduce merc pool from land forcelimit from 30% to 5% and make that Discipline does not count to them, which is logical from historical perspective
Personally I don't like arbitrary hard limits and it would also be against historical accuracy because mercs played an important role for the larger part of the period EU4 covers. Even the Spanish Army of Flanders as one of the first and largest standing forces in this timeframe had a large percentage of auxiliary troops of Germans, Walloons, Italians etc.
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Martynios
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Hessian Mercenary said:
too similar to Condottieri, which are sadly hidden behind the Mare Nostrum DLC
Personally I don't like arbitrary hard limits and it would also be against historical accuracy because mercs played an important role for the larger part of the period EU4 covers. Even the Spanish Army of Flanders as one of the first and largest standing forces in this timeframe had a large percentage of auxiliary troops of Germans, Walloons, Italians etc.
Those auxiliary troops would definitely be considered non-mercs in the game, since Spain owned those areas and drafted them in Tercio form rather than hiring them as a mercenary company.
Bella Gerant
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Yep, yep. Would like to see mercenaries be extremely useful (and expensive) in the early game (since they were better than normal troops for the first half of the timeline) and gradually loss utility sort of like horde units (30 Years' War saw the transition away from mercenaries to more reliable, less likely to plunder your own lands national troops, after all).
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Mik1984
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I believe that with the new flexible code for unit categories we can expect an expansion patch in the future that will overhaul the mercenary system. The incorporation of some of CKII mechanics is a recurring suggestion, therefore I think it will go there.
PS I don't have inside info, that is just me guestimating
Dominion
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Mik1984 said:
The incorporation of some of CKII mechanics is a recurring suggestion, therefore I think it will go there.
I remember a certain colorchange also being a recurring suggestion.
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