Quick disclaimer before I jump in, his thread is intended to get answers for a lot of the questions I have and to gather informations.
I am presenting my personal approach to get a discussion.
"Taken first" means "Taken as my first mil idea", not first overall.
If you disagree or I have made a mistake, please correct me. The more I hear, the more I learn.
Quantity Ideas
First two ideas in this group are massive.
Manpower recovery speed depends on your max manpower pool. The +50% increase directly translates into regular troops which can replace mercs you might have to use with other idea groups chosen.
A very consistent group following a single theme. Nice design.
Your plan is to make a lot and make it cheap.
Increased Garrison Size is the only outlier and can prove very useful in MP. Garrison size determines how many troops are needed to siege a fort.
There is a cap as to how far your siege chance can rise. Once Garrison size is halfed, you can lower it by one step.
My issue is how fast it becomes worthless. No matter which nation you play, you will have replaced most of your infantry with mercs by 1700 and have expanded enough to have a good base recovery rate anyways.
Forts in SP aren't used all that much to justify for Conscripted Garrisons to be effective.
Instead of getting an idea group, you're getting a modifier with an expiry date. The fewer wars you fight, the less useful it gets. The bigger you are, the shorter the duration of its usefulness.
A niche use for it presents when you are small and want to ally bigger nations. The FL increase + available mercs allows you to become eligible way faster.
Aside from that, every start that doesn't have the MP pool or FL will go for it in my book.
Examples of nations I have picked this group first with: Tabarestan, Granada, Vijayanagar,
Nations I would not pick it first with: Any GP, anything that's capable of taking out over Ottoman provinces early, nations with a MP recovery speed in their NIs.
Offensive Ideas
Everything you want if you have everything else.
Leader Shock+Fire let's you inflict more damage, Discipline decreases casualties, additional prestige translates into morale, and increased siege ability means you will tick faster.
Again a very nice design and theme. If you are already superior it lets you show it even faster.
Examples of nations I have picked this group first with: Ottoman Empire, France, Muscovy, Bengal
Nations I would not pick it first with: Anything that isn't clearly superior to its neighbours.
I have taken it a lot as my second mil idea group with a lot of nations.
Defensive Ideas
I see myself using Defensive less and less.
In my opinion the policies are dirt.
As for ideas, maneuver only let's you move slightly faster + negate crossing penalties but +1 doesn't guarantee your leader will have the better maneuver value, maintenance modifier can be grabbed from Quantity in the same position and the finisher is a joke. If your enemies' stacks are big enough for it to matter, you are already big enough to be better off taking offensive instead.
Reinforce Speed is lost since you don't have the manpower pool as the smaller nation anyways unless you've taken Quantity, after a lost battle you will often switch to mercs instead and reduced attrition let's you save a bit of cash and manpower, both of which you can get from Quantity as well.
The flat morale boost + AT look nice, but don't justify taking a whole idea group for it.
I have stopped taking this idea group.
Quality Ideas
The.Bomb.
I used to get deterred from it due to 3 naval ideas whose effectiveness is lost. In SP more than in MP, where it does have its use.
I would assume they got thrown in to balance it out since ships aren't used as much. Luckily, the ideas you want come early.
+10% CA for Inf and Cal are massive and complement +1AT very well since AT gained in battle depends on casualty rates meaning your AT will skyrocket which translates into siege ability and a flat morale boost.
I rush the first three, let it sit for a while and come back later once cannons become effective which happens at mil tech 16.
The long-term value is guaranteed with art CA and thanks to the finisher which grants an additional +5% discipline.
Examples of nations I have picked this group first with: Sweden, Austria, Serbia, Mamluks
Aristocratic Ideas
All over the place, not in terms of design but regarding its ingame application.
Cal cost and CA are strong for a long time. Cal does fall off hard ategame, but until then it's massive. Let's you fill your ranks with strong and cheap cal, which is nice as a Horde nation, Poland or similar.
Hostile Core-Creation Cost is extremely underrated in MP but gets lost in SP. Income from vassals has its uses in both.
MP modifier and decreased AT and NT decay are strong, an additional diplomat early is a severely underrated bonus, an additional leader without upkeep helps out early too and bonus loyalty hugely increases the effectiveness of "Raise Additional Levies" when you're sitting below 55% and want to use it.
The real power of aristocratic probably comes from its policies. There isn't a single bad policy unlocked by finishing Aristocratic Ideas.
I never use this idea group because I never played Horde, but feel like I should pick it with other nations as well.
Naval Ideas
Not gonna waste my time.
Questions:
- Is aristocratic used often? Which position and why?
- Which policies are the strongest in your opinion? I still use them way too rarely.
- Are there any fixed points similar to Quality (or Admin) where I rush the first three and stop afterwards?
- Any nations that overly profit from certain mil groups where you wouldn't expect them to?
- General comments and incorrect assumptions I have made?
Cheers,
Dominion
